GM's MLTL with 416-8B

**westend9** · April 4th, 2011, 12:39 AM

Originally Posted by GM

How does the switch sound all by itself when flicked? When the cab is critically damped it should sound the same except amplified. When the switch has a sharp ''snap', 'dullish' implies over-damped, which usually means either too much insulation and/or the cab is tuned too low (doubtful) and/or there's an air leak.

GM

Now that you mention it, the switch is not a sharp "clicker" like the older models. It just has a soft detent. I think we're OK on the click test. Air leak, not a chance, I could use it for holding water. When playing music through the speaker the bass sounds close to the Model 19 sound but less of the west coast bump and a better rolloff. Those frequencies down low now are playing a lot fuller. I should build the second and reserve any judgement until I have them pushed by better gear.

GM · April 4th, 2011, 12:36 PM

OK, but FWIW, you'd be amazed at how much air can leak around a theoretically well sealed driver........... Regardless, 'Dull' tends to be too subjective a call for many, so I still recommend you get a true snap switch to test with. Mine's from a long gone/lamented '55 A-H 104M, but can be had off most any British car at least through the late '60s and if none is available from the junkyard, then they use to still sell cheap knockoffs at discount auto parts emporiums and hardware stores around here.

GM

**westend9** · April 4th, 2011, 01:23 PM

Oh yeah, AH, another commonality surfaces, GM.

I should have kept my modified '57 Morris Minor with the AH drive train. That was a sweet little car. I had it when I lived in Marin Co., CA, close to one of the best roads for casual sports car driving, the trail around Mt. Tamalpais to the coast. As it is, the same BIL that I sourced the special adhesive from, has a Morgan Plus 3. I'll see if he has a switch laying around.

**westend9** · April 6th, 2011, 08:04 AM

I gave up on any further testing, at this point, in favor of building. I now have two cabinets on the ground

GM, your suggestion of an air leak was immediately dismissed because I thought with all of the PL400 in the joints, the gasketing of the bottom hatch, and the driver's gasket, there could be no possibility of such. Was I wrong.

When I dado'd the panels for the center brace, I ran the router to the end of the front and back panels. I thought that the center brace and top/bottom panels would seal this tiny space from the inside. To that, I was wrong. I gave these notches the breath test from the outside and found that the notches in the front panel on both cabinets were leaking quite a bit. I can push quite a bit of air through them. I will remedy that ASAP.

I will definitely get a clicker going (found a suitable toggle, an older one from a castoff piece) and plan to replace the R-13 that I have in there now. The little bit of time I've had the one playing told me that this is a good alignment and should prove to be just what I had envisioned. Thanks, again for sharing your design and time with me on this. :thankU:

I will be doing some finishing on these and building out the horn sleds as time allows. I looked at the calendar and it tells me that My Uncle Sam is going to want to see how little I made last year and exact tribute. I will be concentrating on that for a few days.

GM · April 6th, 2011, 09:33 AM

Yeah, the longer I've been on audio forums, the more I've come to appreciate Altec's and the other pioneer's design philosophy of intentionally designing in some leakage and adjusting box size and/or vent tuning to get an acceptable result because even if they could reliably manufacture an airtight product the odds are that the tuning would go away the first time it's opened in any way, so in the scheme of things a wasted added cost better spent on either improved components for pro use or fit/finish to improve 'curb appeal' of consumer products.

Why get rid of the R-13? If nothing else, I'm curious how it works out.........

Ugh! I just had my little reminder program pop up to remind me to file too, though being below the poverty level, yet above the minimum required to file a return, it's just a paper exercise with no tax either paid or owed. Seems like they would make the two $$$ points the same, but apparently their need for keeping their workforce ever increasing is the reason for the spread.

GM

**westend9** · April 6th, 2011, 02:05 PM

Originally Posted by GM

Yeah, the longer I've been on audio forums, the more I've come to appreciate Altec's and the other pioneer's design philosophy of intentionally designing in some leakage and adjusting box size and/or vent tuning to get an acceptable result because even if they could reliably manufacture an airtight product the odds are that the tuning would go away the first time it's opened in any way, so in the scheme of things a wasted added cost better spent on either improved components for pro use or fit/finish to improve 'curb appeal' of consumer products.

Why get rid of the R-13? If nothing else, I'm curious how it works out.........

Ugh! I just had my little reminder program pop up to remind me to file too, though being below the poverty level, yet above the minimum required to file a return, it's just a paper exercise with no tax either paid or owed. Seems like they would make the two $$$ points the same, but apparently their need for keeping their workforce ever increasing is the reason for the spread.

GM

GM, in looking at densities of the R-13 and the OC 703, there is a 2lb. difference (703=3 lbs/cu. ft., R13 =1.0 lbs./ft.). I have installed approximately 4u ft. of R-13 in each cabinet, if my calculations are correct.

I'm sure your Uncle Sam wants a tabulation each year so that, in the future, when he gets ready to pay down our debt, you'll tally the numbers and a different result comes about.

I am still on the fence if I should start collecting some of that SS money that my Uncle has been hanging onto for me or if I should trust him to hang onto it for a few more years. I need to get that sorted out in the near future.

One thing I'm noticing, again, after only a brief stint at the accounting desk, is that we are paying a big amount for gasoline. Go figure.